I’ve just added this book to my TBR list! Thanks for the interview. Some of the points were reminding me of my current audiobook read, Visual Thinking by Temple Grandin. She’s basically making the argument, that how and what we teach in schools is geared to one type of learning, and one type of personality and one type of goal. That typically being academic. And especially for folks with disabilities or learning differences, they get written off, early on, in the traditional school sense. But most great thinkers, inventors, artists, etc. were not great at traditional school. They succeeded because others around them-- mostly their families believed in them-- they were able to try different things, gain exposure to different things, and figure out what worked for them to become successful. It kind of requires us reexamining what we think a successful career or life looks like. Realizing that what works for some is not what will work for all.
Hey Bridgitte, you know, I picked up Visual Thinking right around when it came out, but somehow didn't end up reading it. Thanks for this reminder! Really appreciate this comment, and in general — at least to me — it gets at the larger idea of "match quality," or the degree of fit between one's interests, abilities, and the work one does. Turns out to be very important for performance and fulfillment. Since doing the research for my last book, I've come to think that we should put more thoughtful emphasis on helping people improve their match quality, rather than just trying to cram everyone into the same developmental pathways. Not to say there aren't some important and common fundamentals, but just to say that I very much agree with your conclusion.
So many takeaways. Firstly, genius is gifted and accident. Underdogs make a good case study -they sometimes bloom late or no one made a bet on them. Writing is that way, transitions of seasons. Secondly, productivity is in resting, re-fuelling to recreate. And thirdly- ChatGPT may be able to organzie our thoughts but it will be still not be able to write humanistic touch. All our writings and research resonate even with data with a storytelling and kindness behind it . The current world situation is an example- rationalists, thinkers, political figures, everyone whose got a sight of compassion, a voice and pen to truth- is speaking up in global context. Leaving here a thought- we are all a hit away- may it not be a one hit wonder but a wanderings of wonder realm. Be that last marking in a timeline.
Thank you , that coming from you , means a lot. As I ve followed Adam and your work since some years now. I hope you get to read my writings and published work. I post on on instagram @ mariamskchannel and on Twitter. I also would love to interview you on Uncut Conversation-that I host virtually.
I doubt anyone will see this comment months after the fact, but I only just now got around to reading this one. Adam's sentence "But potential is not about where you start — it’s a matter of how far you’ll travel" kinda blew me away. This describes my life experience--personally and professionally. Professionally, I did a full military career as an officer, where half the point of it is to change jobs frequently to acquire a breadth of experience and skills. I performed well at every job, but I never quite felt I had "command" over the duties...like I knew exactly what to do in every situation, and why (if that's even possible). But in my last job in the military and my first job outside the military, I was surprised at how little surprised me. It seemed I had solved every problem at least once before, and this has helped me bring some strong, valuable convictions to what I'm doing (arguably, good strategic vision comes from this place of conviction). This is especially true in my current role in the private sector: my broad experience feels like a superpower. Basically, my prior experiences were investments, and those investments grew over time until the magic of compound interest and time have produced really high ROI I was not expecting. I'm glad my career ceiling was not permanently set when I was younger. Or rather, I'm glad that potential = how far I'll go, not where I started.
Such a fun Q&A thanks, David! I love reading Adam Grant, so it was really cool to see you interview him. As a teacher the topic resonates so strongly. I'll think a lot about how to find tasks that are uncomfortable for my students (and therefore better for learning) but not so uncomfortable as to be demoralizing. And I'll sprinkle in some deliberate play too. If I may, do you have a genuine answer to the question Adam Grant asked you? To the extent that you're comfortable sharing, what advice would you give someone in your position? Thanks as always.
Ps- From how Grant phrased it, it sounded like you'd interviewed R.A. Dickey yourself. So I googled and found your article ( https://www.si.com/sportsperson/2012/11/20/ra-dickey-david-epstein ) -- great piece about a fascinating athlete (even if he is the reason Kershaw didn't win 4 straight Cy Young awards).
Matt, honestly, I would not have believed I'd written this about Dickey if you hadn't produced it. Completely did not remember this piece! Not sure I've ever had that experience before...
Regarding a genuine answer to the question Adam asked, regarding advice I'd give a writer in my particular spot... I think I'd probably tell them to pause the "search" phase of information gathering for the moment and just pick a prospective chapter and start trying to write it, and that will help you identify some concrete holes so you can start moving from the expansive, wide-net search phase, into a more targeted search phase that includes some writing. Basically, doing a little prototyping of possible chapters, because even if it doesn't turn out material that stays in the end, it helps to have something concrete for refining ideas. Am I addressing the question you were asking?
haha...well, one of my closest friends is a diehard Chiefs fan, and we had a long-running bet about whether the Cubs or Chiefs would win a championship first, so I'm guessing I was taking a dig at him;) Those "my sportsman" online pieces were basically taking all volunteers, and you could write a few hundred words on whatever you wanted, so I wouldn't put an inside joke past me on one of those.
And by the way, regarding my "genuine" advice, there is a nugget of truth in the quip I made. Not that I would tell someone to get out while they can, but I'm fairly often approached by someone who wants to write a book, and it's often the case that they don't really read books, but still have a romantic sense of book writing...which is totally fine! I did too. But I think it makes sense to step back a bit and ask oneself what you're hoping to get out of a book project. I think it's often the case that people view it as a form of self-expression that contrasts with their other work. That may be true, but if self-expression is the primary motivation, then I don't think jumping right to book-writing is really the way to go, especially for someone who isn't already a book lover. I don't view book writing as self expression, but rather as a very compelling thing to do and amazing framework for my own curiosity and learning, and hopefully with some ability to help good ideas spread. But I also find it extremely painful. Much like training for the 800, an extremely compelling thing to do, but perhaps not the kind of thing that I would blithely encourage everyone to do. ...But to each their own! My wife exuded joy during the actual writing of her book and would love to do it again someday. My experience is more the 800-training genre.
this was a great article and I'm looking forward to buying the book. Grant is an interesting writer with great ideas. Unfortunately I'm very disappointed by Grant's reaction to the coleman hughes TED talk. he seems to be revealing a bias and instead of considering that Hughes might have an interesting way of looking at problem, he dismisses it outright under the guise of "all the research shows." Really? I saw that research and beg to differ. I suggest the two occupy the same stage and hammer it out. Despite any of that, I'll buy the book.
cool. And thanks for this, as an educator I'm always looking for new ideas and this book looks great. I just thought his response on Hughes was unfortunate.
Check out the full story. In my opinion, Grant made a complete ass of himself. The more he tries to justify his conduct, the worse he looks. He needs to just politely apologize. Otherwise, there are plenty of other people to give my attention.
I’ve just added this book to my TBR list! Thanks for the interview. Some of the points were reminding me of my current audiobook read, Visual Thinking by Temple Grandin. She’s basically making the argument, that how and what we teach in schools is geared to one type of learning, and one type of personality and one type of goal. That typically being academic. And especially for folks with disabilities or learning differences, they get written off, early on, in the traditional school sense. But most great thinkers, inventors, artists, etc. were not great at traditional school. They succeeded because others around them-- mostly their families believed in them-- they were able to try different things, gain exposure to different things, and figure out what worked for them to become successful. It kind of requires us reexamining what we think a successful career or life looks like. Realizing that what works for some is not what will work for all.
Hey Bridgitte, you know, I picked up Visual Thinking right around when it came out, but somehow didn't end up reading it. Thanks for this reminder! Really appreciate this comment, and in general — at least to me — it gets at the larger idea of "match quality," or the degree of fit between one's interests, abilities, and the work one does. Turns out to be very important for performance and fulfillment. Since doing the research for my last book, I've come to think that we should put more thoughtful emphasis on helping people improve their match quality, rather than just trying to cram everyone into the same developmental pathways. Not to say there aren't some important and common fundamentals, but just to say that I very much agree with your conclusion.
So many takeaways. Firstly, genius is gifted and accident. Underdogs make a good case study -they sometimes bloom late or no one made a bet on them. Writing is that way, transitions of seasons. Secondly, productivity is in resting, re-fuelling to recreate. And thirdly- ChatGPT may be able to organzie our thoughts but it will be still not be able to write humanistic touch. All our writings and research resonate even with data with a storytelling and kindness behind it . The current world situation is an example- rationalists, thinkers, political figures, everyone whose got a sight of compassion, a voice and pen to truth- is speaking up in global context. Leaving here a thought- we are all a hit away- may it not be a one hit wonder but a wanderings of wonder realm. Be that last marking in a timeline.
I don't have anything to add, just that you leave the most poetic comments.
Thank you , that coming from you , means a lot. As I ve followed Adam and your work since some years now. I hope you get to read my writings and published work. I post on on instagram @ mariamskchannel and on Twitter. I also would love to interview you on Uncut Conversation-that I host virtually.
Pre-ordered the book! Thanks for sharing.
Thanks for reading, Sorin!
I doubt anyone will see this comment months after the fact, but I only just now got around to reading this one. Adam's sentence "But potential is not about where you start — it’s a matter of how far you’ll travel" kinda blew me away. This describes my life experience--personally and professionally. Professionally, I did a full military career as an officer, where half the point of it is to change jobs frequently to acquire a breadth of experience and skills. I performed well at every job, but I never quite felt I had "command" over the duties...like I knew exactly what to do in every situation, and why (if that's even possible). But in my last job in the military and my first job outside the military, I was surprised at how little surprised me. It seemed I had solved every problem at least once before, and this has helped me bring some strong, valuable convictions to what I'm doing (arguably, good strategic vision comes from this place of conviction). This is especially true in my current role in the private sector: my broad experience feels like a superpower. Basically, my prior experiences were investments, and those investments grew over time until the magic of compound interest and time have produced really high ROI I was not expecting. I'm glad my career ceiling was not permanently set when I was younger. Or rather, I'm glad that potential = how far I'll go, not where I started.
Such a fun Q&A thanks, David! I love reading Adam Grant, so it was really cool to see you interview him. As a teacher the topic resonates so strongly. I'll think a lot about how to find tasks that are uncomfortable for my students (and therefore better for learning) but not so uncomfortable as to be demoralizing. And I'll sprinkle in some deliberate play too. If I may, do you have a genuine answer to the question Adam Grant asked you? To the extent that you're comfortable sharing, what advice would you give someone in your position? Thanks as always.
Ps- From how Grant phrased it, it sounded like you'd interviewed R.A. Dickey yourself. So I googled and found your article ( https://www.si.com/sportsperson/2012/11/20/ra-dickey-david-epstein ) -- great piece about a fascinating athlete (even if he is the reason Kershaw didn't win 4 straight Cy Young awards).
Matt, honestly, I would not have believed I'd written this about Dickey if you hadn't produced it. Completely did not remember this piece! Not sure I've ever had that experience before...
Regarding a genuine answer to the question Adam asked, regarding advice I'd give a writer in my particular spot... I think I'd probably tell them to pause the "search" phase of information gathering for the moment and just pick a prospective chapter and start trying to write it, and that will help you identify some concrete holes so you can start moving from the expansive, wide-net search phase, into a more targeted search phase that includes some writing. Basically, doing a little prototyping of possible chapters, because even if it doesn't turn out material that stays in the end, it helps to have something concrete for refining ideas. Am I addressing the question you were asking?
Wow that's so funny! My favorite part is your joke about the Chiefs being bad. How times have changed.
Yeah that addresses it well. I looked through the research doodles you linked, and (1) they're terrific and (2) your advice seems to line up with this one well! https://www.instagram.com/p/CvH5d2Ruolm/?igshid=MTc4MmM1YmI2Ng==
haha...well, one of my closest friends is a diehard Chiefs fan, and we had a long-running bet about whether the Cubs or Chiefs would win a championship first, so I'm guessing I was taking a dig at him;) Those "my sportsman" online pieces were basically taking all volunteers, and you could write a few hundred words on whatever you wanted, so I wouldn't put an inside joke past me on one of those.
And by the way, regarding my "genuine" advice, there is a nugget of truth in the quip I made. Not that I would tell someone to get out while they can, but I'm fairly often approached by someone who wants to write a book, and it's often the case that they don't really read books, but still have a romantic sense of book writing...which is totally fine! I did too. But I think it makes sense to step back a bit and ask oneself what you're hoping to get out of a book project. I think it's often the case that people view it as a form of self-expression that contrasts with their other work. That may be true, but if self-expression is the primary motivation, then I don't think jumping right to book-writing is really the way to go, especially for someone who isn't already a book lover. I don't view book writing as self expression, but rather as a very compelling thing to do and amazing framework for my own curiosity and learning, and hopefully with some ability to help good ideas spread. But I also find it extremely painful. Much like training for the 800, an extremely compelling thing to do, but perhaps not the kind of thing that I would blithely encourage everyone to do. ...But to each their own! My wife exuded joy during the actual writing of her book and would love to do it again someday. My experience is more the 800-training genre.
“And now I’ll use Glennie for a segue!”
This was *fun* to read!
How's that for an inelegant transition? ;) ...So glad you enjoyed Emily!
Elegant!
this was a great article and I'm looking forward to buying the book. Grant is an interesting writer with great ideas. Unfortunately I'm very disappointed by Grant's reaction to the coleman hughes TED talk. he seems to be revealing a bias and instead of considering that Hughes might have an interesting way of looking at problem, he dismisses it outright under the guise of "all the research shows." Really? I saw that research and beg to differ. I suggest the two occupy the same stage and hammer it out. Despite any of that, I'll buy the book.
Hi Gino, I wasn't aware of the Coleman Hughes TED Talk at all. Thanks for bringing it up, as I'm now curious and will check it out.
cool. And thanks for this, as an educator I'm always looking for new ideas and this book looks great. I just thought his response on Hughes was unfortunate.
Check out the full story. In my opinion, Grant made a complete ass of himself. The more he tries to justify his conduct, the worse he looks. He needs to just politely apologize. Otherwise, there are plenty of other people to give my attention.