Love the short post because more of your thinking shared is always good. Reading did prompt one question - you write about "increased randomness" and that just made me wonder, is random a fixed value? Can you be more or less random? Can you be more or less five? Fun way to start my day. Thank you!
Haha...fair point. I believe what they're really referring to with "increasing randomness" is increased variability — more akin to a "random walk" process of making moves than a systematic approach which should progress predictably toward a better solution. One point they noted in a section about this was that the subjects' first attempt was more carelessly thrown together; specifically, they were less likely to take a "greedy algorithm" approach in which they select the best option available at that moment. ...That's in the weeds, but I think they're using a more colloquial sense of "random," but really mean more careless, or higher variance with respect to quality. In fact, I think it's actually extremely difficult for humans to do anything in a legitimately random manner! Thanks for the thought-provoking point;)
Big fan of the short post. I like reading through your thoughts and it's easy for me to find time to read it! Also really love this quote: "it pays to try to be a scientist of yourself". This applies to so many different areas of life and people would really benefit to listen. Whether it's how much sleep you need, your diet, what exercise you do, etc. There are so many different bio hacks, diets, magic pills out there nowadays that promise to be a cure-all. In reality, I imagine people would be far better off listening to their bodies and not trying to mimic the morning routine of some CEO thinking that will lead to success.
Haha...totally agree, Jack. Not to say I'm not interested in the routines of others, but I try to take them as ideas for things to try if I'm looking for a change, not as gospel to mimic.
As one who has ADHD I was fully prepared to be upset about this. But, in the end, the conclusion is spot-on. I know that for decades I didn't know I had ADHD and my work and personal life suffered. I was like the mice you discuss, I was constantly seeking my dopamine fix, not understanding what I was doing. I know what my Ritalin does for me but I don't know what it would do to someone who doesn't need it.
Hey Chris, I appreciate you suspending being upset and giving a read! I wanted to be careful to point out that this research is about people who do not need the drugs for a legitimate condition, so I'm glad that came through. As you imply, for people who do need it, I suspect the results would be different. Thanks for reading, and for sharing.
Great post, thank you! I think we all would like clear, absolute answers, but it really does seem like treating our lives as an ongoing science experiment is the way to go.
Very well put, Steve. I think I've become somewhat better over time at being a scientist of myself, as opposed to lawyer for whatever my first reflex is;)
Thanks, David. I really appreciate the note at the end too where you say that it's part of a bigger body of work. I'm still thinking about how well Good to Go summarizes bodies of research so I liked you making a nod to something similar. I'm curious now about when you said you molded your work environment to fit your motivational and performance rhythms. What are some ways you've done that?
Hey Matt. One of the major things for me has been planning to work in intervals with little breaks instead thinking I can focus well for hours on end. That said, I also decided to steal from poker pros, who make sure to keep playing when they're locked in, and quit early when they aren't, so I also pay attention and if I happen to really be having an easy time focusing, I'll take advantage of that time. I've also just slowly adapted things from the sound environment, to the layout stuff in my office, to the order of my tasks. (I now never start the day with email, because it'll get me in the wrong place for trying to re-focus on other work, since I can only leave my inbox realizing how much isn't done. And I don't read news for breaks anymore, because I find it doesn't accomplish what I want a break to accomplish, which is to relax for a few minutes. ...All sorts of stuff like that. Perhaps my silliest one is that if I find my brain getting a little frantic, I'll do something that forces me to slow down. These are typically either writing a haiku — not just for the poem, but haiku is all about focusing intently on some physical thing in the world — or shaving with a straight razor, because that really forces me to slow down and pay attention if I don't want to walk away with a gaping wound. I feel sort of ridiculous saying this stuff, but these are things I do. I find that my problem is rarely not working fast enough, but frequently not working slowly enough, so I'm oriented toward things that slow me down. With speaking too, I talk fast naturally, and it can be way too fast if I'm too riled up before a talk. So also no coffee!)
I'm an ADHD coach (and have it myself). The irony that many of the people I work with would rather not take meds if possible. They often come to me looking for ways to structure their life so they can get the most out of ADHD without the meds.
Also, +1 for a short post today, my ADHD brain thanks you.
Hey Hyla, I believe it! (And I wonder if some of those structuring practices would be helpful for a lot of people without ADHD too, just perhaps less of an absolute necessity?) In any case, thanks for reading, for your work, and for this comment.
Are there any studies on the opposite? Ie Folks who think they need to calm down before a big test and take a beta blocker or the like. I'd be curious about whether folks perform better or just think they do.
Andrew, very interesting question. I don't know off the top of my head, but now I'm curious, and will probably look into it at some point. I know for sure that beta blockers are sometimes used (illicitly) in sports, like shooting, where people really want to stay calm and lower their heart rate.
I think the mechanism for beta-blockers affects adrenaline (epinephrine), so that could be another helpful search term to throw in the mix. The increased heart rate, cold hands, etc from adrenaline can be interpreted as excitement/anxiety/fear, so I imagine blockers would help performance for folks with anxiety who tend to freeze up.
Public speaking is the other area you see Beta blockers used openly or discreetly. The goal is to keep the speaker from total anxiety and meltdown. I've always wondered it it were just a placebo effect. But as someone who has used them for hypertension in the past, they certainly do affect you.
I have many colleagues/friends who use beta blockers for public speaking which has always fascinated me because I have zero anxiety about public speaking (though I do have many other anxieties 😉). Having recently been diagnosed with ADHD, I wonder if it is the dopamine hit that comes from having to face a room full of people that focuses me and gives me the calm presence to speak. These same people will have no problem sitting quietly and producing consistent, quality work, while I fidget, fret and procrastinate my way through the day 😁
Interesting! ...I get really nervous before speaking, just as I used to before racing, but in both cases I find that to be a sort of thrilling aspect of life, and the management of it to be an interesting challenge. But I definitely have had to work on that. I suppose at this point, I'd probably get nervous if I didn't get nervous;) I didn't realize people were using beta blockers for public speaking, though. In any case, thanks so much for this comment, Sarah, always really interesting to hear specific examples of our individual differences.
Adding my agreement to the other thumbs-ups [I might have made up the plural on that one] on short posts. This one was a fun and helpful read. AND I hope you also expand on this idea in a longer post in the future. For instance, is there a difference in the effect of pain killers on a person depending on if they have pain or not? Same with so many other drugs. As you say, we need to know much more about individual conditions and responses, to everything. But of course, considering the complexity of interactions in even one person's body, the idea of truly personalized medicine will likely remain a distant goal.
Hi David - I'm Arun from India. Range is one of the most helpful books I've read till date.
Coming to the point of this article, I have some personal experience to share. I recently got diagnosed with adult ADHD (in Aug 2023) and have been taking Ritalin for the last 3 months. The biggest way it has helped me is to chug along through the hard things and to push work to completion. The ADHD brain/nervous system works based on ICNU (Interest, Challenge, Novelty and Urgency), while the neurotypical brain can work based on importance. (more on this here - https://adhd.dk/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2022/05/Dodson-How-ADHD-Shapes-Your-Perceptions-Emotions-.pdf)
Without Ritalin, my mind would go beserk and from pillar to post in search of dopamine. I would be hyperactive, impulsive and have a tough time focusing my attention on the task at hand. I would have done a million things before realizing all that i had done was a waste of time (it is quite difficult to get this unless you have ADHD yourself). There is a popular quote in ADHD forums - "we always put in twice the amount of effort to just get half the work done", and this itself is a gross understatement, IMO. Bottomline - My work would be always absolutely scattered and my productivity absolutely zero!
What this study seems to suggest is that, the exact same problem happens even when dopamine exceeds the optimal threshold. It makes your try harder, but it takes your eyes off the ultimate goal. That extra dopamine makes one restless enough to ensure that they quickly lose sight of their ultimate prize!
I'm just jealous of Aristotle who figured out the power of the golden mean before the era of enlightenment and ChatGPT.
I can't agree more with your suggestion on how we all need to be our own scientists and just have one bit to add - we also need to be our own humorists. I literally LAUGHED OUT LOUD {for the first time ever on Substack}, after reading this sentence: "In other words, they tried harder, but did worse. In science, the technical term for that is: LOL." While unfortunately this captures the essence of my 33 year life, I'm at least glad that now I know the most important thing in life (Dopamine)!!!
Fascinating! Have they developed a biological test to see who has a high number of dopamine receptors and who is low? It seems like that would be an important cross-reference for the knapsack test, so that you could show a direct correlation between dopamine levels, receptors, and performance. Otherwise it's just inferred. But I really enjoyed this post and would encourage you to do more. I also think these kinds of studies are super important, because it's *so easy* to mistake how you feel with how you think you're performing--a conclusion one could apply even in situations without smart drugs.
Hey Jen! I don't know the whole story here...I know dopamine levels can be measured with a blood test, but that doesn't actually represent dopamine in the brain. There are special imaging techniques that can measure dopamine in the brain, but I don't think these are used for typical diagnosis. I think it's usually more an issue of inferring from symptoms and response to drugs. And hopefully I don't butcher this history, but I think that for, say, Parkinson's, in which people have a loss of dopamine, early studies were actually looking at tissue of post-mortem brains and seeing the loss of dopamine. And then giving humans or animals L-Dopa (which is converted into dopamine), would alter their symptoms. That's not what you're asking, but I remember reading about it, and thought it was an interesting bit of medical history. For daily practical purposes though, I assume inference is typically what's happening. ...in any case, your point about mistaking how you feel with how you think you're performing is a great one! I keep seeing this in research on learning, and even though I know it's true, it still feels so counterintuitive.
Love the short post because more of your thinking shared is always good. Reading did prompt one question - you write about "increased randomness" and that just made me wonder, is random a fixed value? Can you be more or less random? Can you be more or less five? Fun way to start my day. Thank you!
Haha...fair point. I believe what they're really referring to with "increasing randomness" is increased variability — more akin to a "random walk" process of making moves than a systematic approach which should progress predictably toward a better solution. One point they noted in a section about this was that the subjects' first attempt was more carelessly thrown together; specifically, they were less likely to take a "greedy algorithm" approach in which they select the best option available at that moment. ...That's in the weeds, but I think they're using a more colloquial sense of "random," but really mean more careless, or higher variance with respect to quality. In fact, I think it's actually extremely difficult for humans to do anything in a legitimately random manner! Thanks for the thought-provoking point;)
Big fan of the short post. I like reading through your thoughts and it's easy for me to find time to read it! Also really love this quote: "it pays to try to be a scientist of yourself". This applies to so many different areas of life and people would really benefit to listen. Whether it's how much sleep you need, your diet, what exercise you do, etc. There are so many different bio hacks, diets, magic pills out there nowadays that promise to be a cure-all. In reality, I imagine people would be far better off listening to their bodies and not trying to mimic the morning routine of some CEO thinking that will lead to success.
Haha...totally agree, Jack. Not to say I'm not interested in the routines of others, but I try to take them as ideas for things to try if I'm looking for a change, not as gospel to mimic.
The Q&A are nice.I think the format creates a natural break and makes for an easier read
Great post - keep the short ones coming.
For anyone interested in dopamine and motivation I can highly recommend Dr. Anna Lembke’s book: “Dopamine nation” and the Hubermann lab podcast!
Appreciate it! And I'll add Lembke to the reading list.
As one who has ADHD I was fully prepared to be upset about this. But, in the end, the conclusion is spot-on. I know that for decades I didn't know I had ADHD and my work and personal life suffered. I was like the mice you discuss, I was constantly seeking my dopamine fix, not understanding what I was doing. I know what my Ritalin does for me but I don't know what it would do to someone who doesn't need it.
Hey Chris, I appreciate you suspending being upset and giving a read! I wanted to be careful to point out that this research is about people who do not need the drugs for a legitimate condition, so I'm glad that came through. As you imply, for people who do need it, I suspect the results would be different. Thanks for reading, and for sharing.
You write it, I’ll read it.
Great post, thank you! I think we all would like clear, absolute answers, but it really does seem like treating our lives as an ongoing science experiment is the way to go.
Very well put, Steve. I think I've become somewhat better over time at being a scientist of myself, as opposed to lawyer for whatever my first reflex is;)
I like all your writing-- so write whatever you want and I’ll probably read it!
That is extremely kind of you to say!
Thanks, David. I really appreciate the note at the end too where you say that it's part of a bigger body of work. I'm still thinking about how well Good to Go summarizes bodies of research so I liked you making a nod to something similar. I'm curious now about when you said you molded your work environment to fit your motivational and performance rhythms. What are some ways you've done that?
Hey Matt. One of the major things for me has been planning to work in intervals with little breaks instead thinking I can focus well for hours on end. That said, I also decided to steal from poker pros, who make sure to keep playing when they're locked in, and quit early when they aren't, so I also pay attention and if I happen to really be having an easy time focusing, I'll take advantage of that time. I've also just slowly adapted things from the sound environment, to the layout stuff in my office, to the order of my tasks. (I now never start the day with email, because it'll get me in the wrong place for trying to re-focus on other work, since I can only leave my inbox realizing how much isn't done. And I don't read news for breaks anymore, because I find it doesn't accomplish what I want a break to accomplish, which is to relax for a few minutes. ...All sorts of stuff like that. Perhaps my silliest one is that if I find my brain getting a little frantic, I'll do something that forces me to slow down. These are typically either writing a haiku — not just for the poem, but haiku is all about focusing intently on some physical thing in the world — or shaving with a straight razor, because that really forces me to slow down and pay attention if I don't want to walk away with a gaping wound. I feel sort of ridiculous saying this stuff, but these are things I do. I find that my problem is rarely not working fast enough, but frequently not working slowly enough, so I'm oriented toward things that slow me down. With speaking too, I talk fast naturally, and it can be way too fast if I'm too riled up before a talk. So also no coffee!)
Great, great, great job.
Thought provoking and an entertaining thoughts and commentary. It even gave me time for including the comments!
It’s good to run some 800 races and not just 5km/10km!
hahaha...Steve, you have me figured out a little too well;)
I'm an ADHD coach (and have it myself). The irony that many of the people I work with would rather not take meds if possible. They often come to me looking for ways to structure their life so they can get the most out of ADHD without the meds.
Also, +1 for a short post today, my ADHD brain thanks you.
Hey Hyla, I believe it! (And I wonder if some of those structuring practices would be helpful for a lot of people without ADHD too, just perhaps less of an absolute necessity?) In any case, thanks for reading, for your work, and for this comment.
Are there any studies on the opposite? Ie Folks who think they need to calm down before a big test and take a beta blocker or the like. I'd be curious about whether folks perform better or just think they do.
Andrew, very interesting question. I don't know off the top of my head, but now I'm curious, and will probably look into it at some point. I know for sure that beta blockers are sometimes used (illicitly) in sports, like shooting, where people really want to stay calm and lower their heart rate.
I think the mechanism for beta-blockers affects adrenaline (epinephrine), so that could be another helpful search term to throw in the mix. The increased heart rate, cold hands, etc from adrenaline can be interpreted as excitement/anxiety/fear, so I imagine blockers would help performance for folks with anxiety who tend to freeze up.
Public speaking is the other area you see Beta blockers used openly or discreetly. The goal is to keep the speaker from total anxiety and meltdown. I've always wondered it it were just a placebo effect. But as someone who has used them for hypertension in the past, they certainly do affect you.
I have many colleagues/friends who use beta blockers for public speaking which has always fascinated me because I have zero anxiety about public speaking (though I do have many other anxieties 😉). Having recently been diagnosed with ADHD, I wonder if it is the dopamine hit that comes from having to face a room full of people that focuses me and gives me the calm presence to speak. These same people will have no problem sitting quietly and producing consistent, quality work, while I fidget, fret and procrastinate my way through the day 😁
Interesting! ...I get really nervous before speaking, just as I used to before racing, but in both cases I find that to be a sort of thrilling aspect of life, and the management of it to be an interesting challenge. But I definitely have had to work on that. I suppose at this point, I'd probably get nervous if I didn't get nervous;) I didn't realize people were using beta blockers for public speaking, though. In any case, thanks so much for this comment, Sarah, always really interesting to hear specific examples of our individual differences.
Adding my agreement to the other thumbs-ups [I might have made up the plural on that one] on short posts. This one was a fun and helpful read. AND I hope you also expand on this idea in a longer post in the future. For instance, is there a difference in the effect of pain killers on a person depending on if they have pain or not? Same with so many other drugs. As you say, we need to know much more about individual conditions and responses, to everything. But of course, considering the complexity of interactions in even one person's body, the idea of truly personalized medicine will likely remain a distant goal.
Hi David - I'm Arun from India. Range is one of the most helpful books I've read till date.
Coming to the point of this article, I have some personal experience to share. I recently got diagnosed with adult ADHD (in Aug 2023) and have been taking Ritalin for the last 3 months. The biggest way it has helped me is to chug along through the hard things and to push work to completion. The ADHD brain/nervous system works based on ICNU (Interest, Challenge, Novelty and Urgency), while the neurotypical brain can work based on importance. (more on this here - https://adhd.dk/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2022/05/Dodson-How-ADHD-Shapes-Your-Perceptions-Emotions-.pdf)
Without Ritalin, my mind would go beserk and from pillar to post in search of dopamine. I would be hyperactive, impulsive and have a tough time focusing my attention on the task at hand. I would have done a million things before realizing all that i had done was a waste of time (it is quite difficult to get this unless you have ADHD yourself). There is a popular quote in ADHD forums - "we always put in twice the amount of effort to just get half the work done", and this itself is a gross understatement, IMO. Bottomline - My work would be always absolutely scattered and my productivity absolutely zero!
What this study seems to suggest is that, the exact same problem happens even when dopamine exceeds the optimal threshold. It makes your try harder, but it takes your eyes off the ultimate goal. That extra dopamine makes one restless enough to ensure that they quickly lose sight of their ultimate prize!
I'm just jealous of Aristotle who figured out the power of the golden mean before the era of enlightenment and ChatGPT.
I can't agree more with your suggestion on how we all need to be our own scientists and just have one bit to add - we also need to be our own humorists. I literally LAUGHED OUT LOUD {for the first time ever on Substack}, after reading this sentence: "In other words, they tried harder, but did worse. In science, the technical term for that is: LOL." While unfortunately this captures the essence of my 33 year life, I'm at least glad that now I know the most important thing in life (Dopamine)!!!
Loved the shorter format
Thanks Harley!
Fascinating! Have they developed a biological test to see who has a high number of dopamine receptors and who is low? It seems like that would be an important cross-reference for the knapsack test, so that you could show a direct correlation between dopamine levels, receptors, and performance. Otherwise it's just inferred. But I really enjoyed this post and would encourage you to do more. I also think these kinds of studies are super important, because it's *so easy* to mistake how you feel with how you think you're performing--a conclusion one could apply even in situations without smart drugs.
Hey Jen! I don't know the whole story here...I know dopamine levels can be measured with a blood test, but that doesn't actually represent dopamine in the brain. There are special imaging techniques that can measure dopamine in the brain, but I don't think these are used for typical diagnosis. I think it's usually more an issue of inferring from symptoms and response to drugs. And hopefully I don't butcher this history, but I think that for, say, Parkinson's, in which people have a loss of dopamine, early studies were actually looking at tissue of post-mortem brains and seeing the loss of dopamine. And then giving humans or animals L-Dopa (which is converted into dopamine), would alter their symptoms. That's not what you're asking, but I remember reading about it, and thought it was an interesting bit of medical history. For daily practical purposes though, I assume inference is typically what's happening. ...in any case, your point about mistaking how you feel with how you think you're performing is a great one! I keep seeing this in research on learning, and even though I know it's true, it still feels so counterintuitive.
Enjoyed this short post and learning about the topic. Plan to learn more.
Thank you Linda, and "plan to learn more" is about the best response I hope for with this (hopefully generative) newsletter.