Regarding baseball - I took a CE course on sports vision a while back (like 10 years ago). The eye doc worked with a lot of baseball players with their reaction time, hand-eye coordination, etc. He noted that if the MLB hopeful did not have 20/15 or 20/10 uncorrected visual acuity - they almost never made it to the pro-level. I guess their visual system physiologically could not interpret the required info of the pitch accurately enough to hit well enough.
He also had a specific training exercise he had players do - If I remember correctly - it required catching/throwing a ball in one hand while something was spinning or rotating in the other. He showed us a video of players doing it well and players not able to do it.
The player not able to do it - the doc knew he would likely not advance to pro-level baseball.
That is absolutely true about the vision! I wrote about it in The Sports Gene. The faster the ball speed, the more important that visual acuity became. So you can see it selected for increasing as the level of plays go up. Was your instructor Dr. Daniel Laby by any chance?
I don't remember if it was Dr. Laby. I searched my laptop/emails for a copy of the power point presentation and the lecture title to no success. (I wanted to review my old notes from it before I commented so I didn't say something incorrect.)
The idea that there are certain innate traits (that potentially could be screened for when a teen?) that will preclude you from ever achieving your sports dream left quite an impression on me after that lecture.
I know nothing about baseball, at what age does this become apparent? And is there pressure on young men to get eye surgery they don’t strictly need to improve their sporting chances? (I suspect I know the answer to this one…)
If I recall, there's a steady elimination of players with worse eyesight as the level increases, and then by the top level it's extreme selection. And then at the top level, some of the visual acuity generally declines even in rare specimen at 29, and you do see a fall off for most hitters. In terms of surgery, I don't actually think it would make a difference here, because the real issue is maximum potential visual acuity, which depends on things like the density of cones in the retina. The main thing is that their vision has to be correctable to extraordinary.
It's so interesting!! When a teacher or presenter, I would "read the room". Meaning, that your body and the room vibe helped you get a feel for the audience and know when you're connecting and when you're bombing and hopefully shift gears. I don't know if it's similar, but it feels so. Getting the whole picture and acting accordingly. Or trying to. In any case, thanks. It's interesting to ponder.
I would also say that in addition to Messi doing this, he has extraordinary patience and calmness to then execute. He is not sped up at any point. He is process over results and just calmly executes over and over and over again. The England is a good example where before the equalizer, he just made good play after good play after good play, calmly putting the ball in the box, or passing out if the look wasn’t good; didn’t force anything. An extraordinary mind and player.
A similar phenomenon is also observed in top/level batsmen (cricket). The ball speed is too high to process so they anticipate the ball’s trajectory often picking up cues from the bowler.
Messi is, as one of his teammates at Barcelona said, an extraterrestrial.
He is not an extraterrestrial at all. There are many people on the planet who do this exceedingly well, but you have to learn to spot the errors. Talent is a reduction of errors, and most people think of talent as an acquisition. It's not an acquisition as much as it is a reduction of errors. The other players make more mistakes in every department, and Messi makes fewer mistakes. It's the same thing with an Olympic skier, a chef in a restaurant, etc. There is no magic about this concept. When you approach it from the angle of reduction of errors, then you seem to be an extraterrestrial, but in reality you are not. Messi just happens to be in a sport that is well known, but you will find millions of people who are "Extraterrestrial." in their own field and have never been publicised.
Fascinating neuroscience and psychology in play. As you know better than me, Messi is also conserving his finite physical and mental energy to be able to call forth brief concentrated bursts for those moments he most needs it. And then he goes back to walking again. Great little burst of a post.
I was 35 when I started playing badminton again after quite a long stretch, and my opponents were 89 and 92 years of age, respectively. They barely moved on the court, and they beat us consistently. Over time, you have to learn how to make the maximum amount of impact with the least amount of energy. In reality, this is what thinking is all about. When you start doing something, you can't focus on anything but that thing. When you start driving for the first time, you are thinking of so many things that it's hard to concentrate. After a while, you are capable of turning on the radio, eating a banana, and telling your kid to be quiet, all while huddling down the highway. In effect, you are not using a lot of energy. There is nothing magical about this fact. It's just that the others burn way too much energy, and Messi has figured out a way to burn less, just like those 90-year-olds.
Nicely put. I am among the lucky ones who have seen Messi play live, four times with the National Team in Buenos Aires (the first time was a friendly match in 2010 against then World Cup champion Spain on the heels of their victory in South Africa—looking forward to the Sunday repeat performance), and once in Barcelona. I’ve had the opportunity to home in on Messi’s individual movements and play, which is exactly as you say. And which may just prove Epstein’s point. Fun stuff.
Joshua Foer In Moonwalking with Einstein is a pretty decent book to read about this concept. He became the memory world champion, and he had no interest in doing anything other than documenting what memory champions do. Eventually, it is a matter of chunking, and he is the first to admit that he has no special memory. He forgets his sister's birthday and where he left his keys.
Every chef on the planet in every kitchen uses chunks. If, for instance, you cook Indian food and you are told to put spices, you know that the chunk is coriander powder, cumin powder, turmeric powder, chilli powder, and garam masala. That's a chunk. You don't have to think about it because it's one thing. The onions, garlic, and tomatoes form another chunk.
Indian cooking is seen as extremely complex by many people, but it's relatively simple if you work in chunks. The same applies to any other skill on the planet.
You probably have about a thousand, if not 5,000, names in your head. Think of:
- your family
- your cousins
- the name of your teacher in high school
- all of the actors and actresses
- the sports people
- all the personalities that you know
Then go to all the countries, and there is a name for every object: a table, a spoon, that is all a name. We seem to forget that we have an ability to remember names, but only if we use it on a consistent basis. The other reason why we really forget names is because we don't pay attention. We remember all the names that are important to us, but forget the names of people that are not important, or at least less important.
In this case, you have to assign a picture. It is possible to go into a room and have 50 people, and based on their location and the picture you assign to them, you will be able to remember all their names. Of course, if you don't run into them anymore, you will forget most of their names in a week or so, maybe even earlier.
People call it instinct and intuition because they can't explain it. When you can explain it, it's called science. Not being able to explain it is actually what makes it sound so magical. We think of everything that we could not explain over the centuries, and now we can, and nobody calls it magic. It's pretty much science.
The chunking research is fascinating, and it explains something I've observed for years in markets. Experienced investors aren't necessarily faster thinkers than novices. They're better pattern-recognizers. A seasoned investor looks at a chart or a market reaction and instantly "chunks" it into a familiar pattern: a rate-hike cycle, an earnings surprise, a sentiment extreme, etc. It's the same way Messi reads a defense.
The danger, of course, is when the chunk is wrong. Pattern recognition built on limited experience can be just as confidently miscalibrated as it is accurate. The 2008 crisis was full of experienced professionals whose "chunks" were built for a world that no longer existed.
There was an interesting piece of analysis I saw a couple of weeks ago, talking about how he not only walks more than anyone else, but he spends a large proportion of time standing still. This is practically unheard of in football, and the analysis was showing how, counterintuitively, that makes him very hard to mark.
I may be still scarred from the headed goal he scored against Man United despite being six inches shorter than all the defenders, but I think of him as some kind of predator. Like an alligator, or a shark, he looks still and disinterested before exploding into action, and that burst is very hard to deal with.
From a ‘Sports Gene’ point of view, the Ronaldo v Messi rivalry has been fascinating too. Ronaldo is clearly a physical outlier, not only his physique, but the way he strikes the ball, his standing jump and, less scientifically, his foot speed. I’ve seen him play in person a lot and it’s hard to articulate, but he has unbelievably quick feet (watch someone doing a double round the world trick for an example)
By contrast, Messi doesn’t seem to be physically exceptional in any way. He’s fairly quick, and has a low centre of gravity, but so do lots of players. His natural advantage is all between his ears.
Cool angle. I’m sure it’s about energy conversation and injury prevention too, but I hadn’t thought as much about mapping the pitch. It’s all very similar to LeBron who walks more than any NBA player.
This is a great take on how peak athletes take time to understand their game. Something I never would have thought of so really appreciated reading this!
Regarding baseball - I took a CE course on sports vision a while back (like 10 years ago). The eye doc worked with a lot of baseball players with their reaction time, hand-eye coordination, etc. He noted that if the MLB hopeful did not have 20/15 or 20/10 uncorrected visual acuity - they almost never made it to the pro-level. I guess their visual system physiologically could not interpret the required info of the pitch accurately enough to hit well enough.
He also had a specific training exercise he had players do - If I remember correctly - it required catching/throwing a ball in one hand while something was spinning or rotating in the other. He showed us a video of players doing it well and players not able to do it.
The player not able to do it - the doc knew he would likely not advance to pro-level baseball.
That is absolutely true about the vision! I wrote about it in The Sports Gene. The faster the ball speed, the more important that visual acuity became. So you can see it selected for increasing as the level of plays go up. Was your instructor Dr. Daniel Laby by any chance?
I don't remember if it was Dr. Laby. I searched my laptop/emails for a copy of the power point presentation and the lecture title to no success. (I wanted to review my old notes from it before I commented so I didn't say something incorrect.)
The idea that there are certain innate traits (that potentially could be screened for when a teen?) that will preclude you from ever achieving your sports dream left quite an impression on me after that lecture.
I know nothing about baseball, at what age does this become apparent? And is there pressure on young men to get eye surgery they don’t strictly need to improve their sporting chances? (I suspect I know the answer to this one…)
If I recall, there's a steady elimination of players with worse eyesight as the level increases, and then by the top level it's extreme selection. And then at the top level, some of the visual acuity generally declines even in rare specimen at 29, and you do see a fall off for most hitters. In terms of surgery, I don't actually think it would make a difference here, because the real issue is maximum potential visual acuity, which depends on things like the density of cones in the retina. The main thing is that their vision has to be correctable to extraordinary.
All the more reason to keep your kids off devices and screens as their visual system develops. Certain aspects of myopia are preventable!
So many reasons!!
Great video and companion newsletter, David! I thought the example of Jenny Finch throwing softballs to MLB players illustrated your points perfectly.
It's so interesting!! When a teacher or presenter, I would "read the room". Meaning, that your body and the room vibe helped you get a feel for the audience and know when you're connecting and when you're bombing and hopefully shift gears. I don't know if it's similar, but it feels so. Getting the whole picture and acting accordingly. Or trying to. In any case, thanks. It's interesting to ponder.
I would also say that in addition to Messi doing this, he has extraordinary patience and calmness to then execute. He is not sped up at any point. He is process over results and just calmly executes over and over and over again. The England is a good example where before the equalizer, he just made good play after good play after good play, calmly putting the ball in the box, or passing out if the look wasn’t good; didn’t force anything. An extraordinary mind and player.
A similar phenomenon is also observed in top/level batsmen (cricket). The ball speed is too high to process so they anticipate the ball’s trajectory often picking up cues from the bowler.
Messi is, as one of his teammates at Barcelona said, an extraterrestrial.
He is not an extraterrestrial at all. There are many people on the planet who do this exceedingly well, but you have to learn to spot the errors. Talent is a reduction of errors, and most people think of talent as an acquisition. It's not an acquisition as much as it is a reduction of errors. The other players make more mistakes in every department, and Messi makes fewer mistakes. It's the same thing with an Olympic skier, a chef in a restaurant, etc. There is no magic about this concept. When you approach it from the angle of reduction of errors, then you seem to be an extraterrestrial, but in reality you are not. Messi just happens to be in a sport that is well known, but you will find millions of people who are "Extraterrestrial." in their own field and have never been publicised.
Fascinating neuroscience and psychology in play. As you know better than me, Messi is also conserving his finite physical and mental energy to be able to call forth brief concentrated bursts for those moments he most needs it. And then he goes back to walking again. Great little burst of a post.
I was 35 when I started playing badminton again after quite a long stretch, and my opponents were 89 and 92 years of age, respectively. They barely moved on the court, and they beat us consistently. Over time, you have to learn how to make the maximum amount of impact with the least amount of energy. In reality, this is what thinking is all about. When you start doing something, you can't focus on anything but that thing. When you start driving for the first time, you are thinking of so many things that it's hard to concentrate. After a while, you are capable of turning on the radio, eating a banana, and telling your kid to be quiet, all while huddling down the highway. In effect, you are not using a lot of energy. There is nothing magical about this fact. It's just that the others burn way too much energy, and Messi has figured out a way to burn less, just like those 90-year-olds.
Nicely put. I am among the lucky ones who have seen Messi play live, four times with the National Team in Buenos Aires (the first time was a friendly match in 2010 against then World Cup champion Spain on the heels of their victory in South Africa—looking forward to the Sunday repeat performance), and once in Barcelona. I’ve had the opportunity to home in on Messi’s individual movements and play, which is exactly as you say. And which may just prove Epstein’s point. Fun stuff.
The chess chunking study is interesting. Makes instinct feel less like magic and more like reps paying off quietly in the background.
Joshua Foer In Moonwalking with Einstein is a pretty decent book to read about this concept. He became the memory world champion, and he had no interest in doing anything other than documenting what memory champions do. Eventually, it is a matter of chunking, and he is the first to admit that he has no special memory. He forgets his sister's birthday and where he left his keys.
Every chef on the planet in every kitchen uses chunks. If, for instance, you cook Indian food and you are told to put spices, you know that the chunk is coriander powder, cumin powder, turmeric powder, chilli powder, and garam masala. That's a chunk. You don't have to think about it because it's one thing. The onions, garlic, and tomatoes form another chunk.
Indian cooking is seen as extremely complex by many people, but it's relatively simple if you work in chunks. The same applies to any other skill on the planet.
This is so interesting. How can I do this for people’s names. I always struggle to remember people’s names
You probably have about a thousand, if not 5,000, names in your head. Think of:
- your family
- your cousins
- the name of your teacher in high school
- all of the actors and actresses
- the sports people
- all the personalities that you know
Then go to all the countries, and there is a name for every object: a table, a spoon, that is all a name. We seem to forget that we have an ability to remember names, but only if we use it on a consistent basis. The other reason why we really forget names is because we don't pay attention. We remember all the names that are important to us, but forget the names of people that are not important, or at least less important.
In this case, you have to assign a picture. It is possible to go into a room and have 50 people, and based on their location and the picture you assign to them, you will be able to remember all their names. Of course, if you don't run into them anymore, you will forget most of their names in a week or so, maybe even earlier.
People call it instinct and intuition because they can't explain it. When you can explain it, it's called science. Not being able to explain it is actually what makes it sound so magical. We think of everything that we could not explain over the centuries, and now we can, and nobody calls it magic. It's pretty much science.
The chunking research is fascinating, and it explains something I've observed for years in markets. Experienced investors aren't necessarily faster thinkers than novices. They're better pattern-recognizers. A seasoned investor looks at a chart or a market reaction and instantly "chunks" it into a familiar pattern: a rate-hike cycle, an earnings surprise, a sentiment extreme, etc. It's the same way Messi reads a defense.
The danger, of course, is when the chunk is wrong. Pattern recognition built on limited experience can be just as confidently miscalibrated as it is accurate. The 2008 crisis was full of experienced professionals whose "chunks" were built for a world that no longer existed.
He should not be allowed to ever play pro soccer again. A real stinking pile, he is.
found the English person
Super interesting. Wondering: how do people who have aphantasia navigate things like this, or are they even able to?
There was an interesting piece of analysis I saw a couple of weeks ago, talking about how he not only walks more than anyone else, but he spends a large proportion of time standing still. This is practically unheard of in football, and the analysis was showing how, counterintuitively, that makes him very hard to mark.
I may be still scarred from the headed goal he scored against Man United despite being six inches shorter than all the defenders, but I think of him as some kind of predator. Like an alligator, or a shark, he looks still and disinterested before exploding into action, and that burst is very hard to deal with.
From a ‘Sports Gene’ point of view, the Ronaldo v Messi rivalry has been fascinating too. Ronaldo is clearly a physical outlier, not only his physique, but the way he strikes the ball, his standing jump and, less scientifically, his foot speed. I’ve seen him play in person a lot and it’s hard to articulate, but he has unbelievably quick feet (watch someone doing a double round the world trick for an example)
By contrast, Messi doesn’t seem to be physically exceptional in any way. He’s fairly quick, and has a low centre of gravity, but so do lots of players. His natural advantage is all between his ears.
This is Haaland’s technique as well—wanders with an eye on likely developments, then sprints.
Cool angle. I’m sure it’s about energy conversation and injury prevention too, but I hadn’t thought as much about mapping the pitch. It’s all very similar to LeBron who walks more than any NBA player.
This is a great take on how peak athletes take time to understand their game. Something I never would have thought of so really appreciated reading this!
Love your comments and detail. So helpful. I honestly think its because I just don't pay attention. I need to change this.
Is Messi the GOAT? The question diminishes him and soccer.
https://thewrightstuff1.substack.com/p/a-thorny-goat-question?r=3t1kwq&utm_medium=ios